Discussion
  • Read More
    The Alvin Greene DreamHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:20pm

    For a long time, I have not wanted to believe that the GOP will fall in line behind Trump. I just couldn’t fathom it would occur. But in the past week or so, as these endorsements for Trump have come out, it’s starting to sink in. I didn’t want to believe the RNC and the Republican establishment were stupid enough to let it happen. But they almost certainly will.

    Now, with that said, if keeping Trump out at all costs is the name of the game for Democrats, I suggest that Clinton supporters think seriously about their candidate’s electability in the general election. We’ve long passed the point where we can afford to trot this out as a cynical bludgeon, based solely on speculation and gut feeling, all the while ignoring the actual data on the topic.

    Please, people. Look at the data. Watch this video:

    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      burnthispleaseThe Alvin Greene Dream
      3/03/16 2:24pm

      This is hysterical. You seriously think the self-proclaimed socialist is more electable than Hillary Clinton? Please go back to your Bernie Bro echo chamber.

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      The Alvin Greene Dreamburnthisplease
      3/03/16 2:30pm

      This is hysterical. You seriously think the self-proclaimed socialist is more electable than Hillary Clinton? Please go back to your Bernie Bro echo chamber.

      Yes, I do seriously think that. But the thing is, it doesn’t matter what I think here, because I’m using polling data—from several different sources by the way, with very similar findings—to make the point.

      Reply
      <
  • Read More
    TheEvilAttorneyHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:14pm

    Yup. While many have complained loudly, essentially none have said that they would not vote for Trump if he was the nominee (with maybe one or two exceptions that are not notable). Unless they loudly proclaim that they will vote Hillary instead of Trump, their words are a mere joke.

    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      GregSamsaTheEvilAttorney
      3/03/16 2:20pm

      Actually, Sanders’ fans are claiming they’ll vote for Trump over Hillary. We made need one of those annoying football chalkboard drawings to work out who voted for what come November.

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      oh-hell-noGregSamsa
      3/03/16 2:26pm

      “Sanders’ fans are claiming they’ll vote for Trump over Hillary”

      Who is claiming this statistic? I find it extremely hard to believe that the liberal fan base that Bernie captures would ever vote for Trump.

      Reply
      <
  • Read More
    Meanwhile, ElsewhereHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:15pm
    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      cepalgMeanwhile, Elsewhere
      3/03/16 2:18pm

      there is some fairness in the assessment that there are two GOTV campaigns on the blue side of the aisle this year and what, six on the red one?

      but it still ain’t what we in the business call good omenry.

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      StAgnesMeanwhile, Elsewhere
      3/03/16 2:19pm

      oh shit

      Reply
      <
  • Read More
    BobbySeriousHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:14pm

    Not sure if I agree with you on this one Hamilton. Your statement that “The establishment is built to perpetuate its own existence” is fully accurate, which is exactly why they are at odds with a Trump nomination, as he will destroy the party.

    So what do they do? They’re fucked either way, we all know that. But IMO, the best long term option may be to denounce Trump, let the party fracture, potentially with a 3rd party of hard liners forming. This would win them points with moderates and the media, and they could begin to re-brand themselves in a more moderate light, which they need to do anyway to have any chance at remaining a national party. Over time they will also largely be able to crush the 3rd party.

    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      Misteaks were madeBobbySerious
      3/03/16 2:16pm

      We can only hope those last 6 words come true.

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      Fleet Admiral JoshBobbySerious
      3/03/16 2:17pm

      Right. A GOP might be more served - if the interest is their perpetuating their own existence - by essentially allowing a President Hillary and consolidating republican opposition to her (hey, it worked with Obama, mostly) - than by allowing Trump to become President - someone who they may not have any control over whatsoever, but if they decide to tie themselves to him, will be bound to whatever he decides to do.

      Reply
      <
  • Read More
    GregoireHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:15pm

    At this point, they’re shipwrecked and will listen to whomever has the conch. People may fight to the bitter end, but we saw what happened to Piggy (in this analogy, Chris Christie).

    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      torchbearer2Gregoire
      3/03/16 2:17pm

      In what analogy would CC not be Piggy?

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      toothpetardGregoire
      3/03/16 2:20pm

      I thought you said ‘peggy’

      Reply
      <
  • Read More
    CultureCannibalHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:21pm

    He still won’t win in the general elections, though. He’d have to be able to carry at least 40% of the Hispanic vote, and he and his fucking wall just aren’t going to pull that off.

    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      EvenBaggierTrousers4CultureCannibal
      3/03/16 2:33pm

      Don’t be surprised if he does a 180 on that. He may not say he’s NOT building a wall, but he’ll start talking about a “path to citizenship,” etc. If there’s one thing he does is pander to whomever he needs to at the time he needs to. Ex.: He’s heading into a debate with Megyn Kelly so what does he do? He jumps up and supports something he thinks will help him win with women. He’s as transparent as Saran Wrap.

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      KyuzoCultureCannibal
      3/03/16 2:45pm

      Drumpf wants to win the presidency without women, Latinos, African-Americans, young voters or immigrants.

      GIF
      Reply
      <
  • Read More
    Vanguard KnightHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:14pm

    I think the true irritation with trump is that he has revealed the open secret that Republicans are a white identity party first and foremost.

    I question if they will ever find the same effectiveness with dog-whistles that they once had.

    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      THORFINN THE DANEVanguard Knight
      3/03/16 2:19pm

      Literally cannot believe a leading candidate for President had to think twice about denouncing the KKK.

      We live in strange times.

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      RedVanguard Knight
      3/03/16 2:21pm

      So by your illogic, the Democrats are a black identity party?

      Reply
      <
  • Read More
    ninjaginHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:19pm

    Here’s the thing, though. Even if Drumpf wins every single primary and caucus left on the calendar, that won’t make him the nominee. The party can nominate anyone they want, and they won’t nominate Drumpf.

    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      52ndstateninjagin
      3/03/16 2:23pm

      That is a remote possibility, but it might be one of the very few things that could tank Republican turnout. Defying the will of their primary electorate would be very, very dangerous.

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      Ianninjagin
      3/03/16 2:25pm

      You really think they’re going to risk looking EVEN MORE like a dumpster fire asteroid? For the sake of “unity” or whatever other crap they come up with, they’ll accept Drumpf.

      Reply
      <
  • Read More
    ArdenHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:39pm

    Unfortunately the same exact thing will happen to us Liberals when Hillary gets the nomination. “Rationalize it. Deal with it. Do it or else. Forget your beliefs, forget your concerns for socialized healthcare, forget income inequality/political finance reform, forget encryption/privacy/NSA. Vote against it all and be happy that you did.”

    We let the Republicans position themselves, which then determines how far to the right we’re illing to vote just to prevent the FAR right from winning. If Romney was running against Trump, Liberals would file in droves to support Romeny. Because we’re cowards. We have no ideals, we have no goals, we have no vision of the future. “Progressive” now simply means “lean against the door like a scene from Walking Dead keeping the zombies out.” We will do this forever because we will always, ALWAYS rationalize away progress with “we can’t let Red Team win” every. Single. Time.

    Of course Republicans will fall in line. We do it all the time.

    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      KyuzoArden
      3/03/16 2:42pm

      Democrats are already prepared to get in line behind Hillary. If Bernie doesn’t get the nomination, there won’t be any hand-wringing.

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      BridgetLovesBurnerArden
      3/03/16 2:44pm

      Speak for yourself. We libs are not a monolith. Many of us will be happy with a centrist like Hilz, who can do the job, continue on a path of incremental change, without promising the moon.

      Reply
      <
  • Read More
    robertogreenHamilton Nolan
    3/03/16 2:16pm

    there is one stance and one stance only in our binary political system if you are a (OH GOD HELP ME) “principled conservative” or (THERE SIMPLY IS NO WAY TO SAY THIS WITHOUT CHOKING ON MY OWN BILE) “principled republican”: “I will not vote for Donald Trump if he is our nominee, but will instead campaign for, give money to, and lend my name and credibility to his opponent that the Democrats nominate, including if that person is Hilary Clinton.”

    all else is total fucking bullshit. a waste of breath. a lie told by a liar.

    Reply
    <
    • Read More
      Wile_Erobertogreen
      3/03/16 2:34pm

      If a significant number of registered (R) jump ship and vote for the Libertarian candidate, it won’t do anything in this election but hand the victory to Clinton/Sanders. But, the GOP establishment will be forced to take notice of a very deliberate message from those voters.

      Reply
      <
    • Read More
      robertogreenWile_E
      3/03/16 6:23pm

      listen, i say this as an asshole who voted for nader in 2000 (though to be fair to myself i did so in california, but still, fuck ME for being so stupid): no. you have to show, proactively, that you will in fact jump ship in a 2 vote way—one, withholding your vote for “your” guy, and two, adding your vote to their gal. that’s the strongest message you can send. you care SO much about your country you’d rather have the other team’s leader win.

      Reply
      <