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    Fresh Courage TakeHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 1:46pm

    The deep south, broadly speaking, is simply holding back America. There can be no other position.

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      I Have No Account and I Must PostFresh Courage Take
      2/18/16 1:48pm

      I honestly think we should just call them up and say, “we’ve been thinking a lot since you tried to break up with us, and maybe you were right.”

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      Darius Miles in "The Perfect Score"Fresh Courage Take
      2/18/16 1:49pm

      Please, this is letting the rest of the country off the hook. Dipshit Congressmen come from all over the country.

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    Ed SpockHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 1:47pm

    Relax for God sakes.

    Sure our infrastructure may be lacking in areas, but it’s not like we have a public water system that poisoned a city of 100,000 people or something.

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      SoullessMonsterEd Spock
      2/18/16 2:19pm

      It’s hilarious that people are trying to pawn off Flint on the Republican Governor.

      Flint’s (Democrat) mayor and city council decided to save money by severing their relationship with their water supplier - the city of Detroit - and draw water from Lake Huron. The Democrats who ran Detroit got pissed and cut off Flint. Flint’s mayor, council and (Democrat) emergency manager then decided to use water from the Flint River for three years until the Huron pipeline was running. The Democrat-run EPA and Michigan’s Dept of Environmental Quality (surely a hotbed of Republicanism) both approved this plan.

      But yeah, blame those awful Republicans.

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      Ed SpockSoullessMonster
      2/18/16 2:24pm

      Since you clearly have no concept of how this unfolded, how the emergency financial manager law works in Michigan, and how the situation was created by the actions of Snyder and the EFM he appointed, all I will respond with is this:

      “What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.”

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    FauxhemianRhapshodyHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 1:49pm

    I work in the design side of the construction industry, and over the past decade, I’ve really come to appreciate how much of our physical infrastructure simply did not existing before 1950. Considering that we've already exceeded the 50 year life-cycle of much of it, I'm very concerned for our future. There is simply not the political will or capital (political or financial) to replace it. We couldn't build the country we have today if we wanted to. A bunch of old white guys would tell us that it costs too much.

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      ReverandRichardWayneGaryWayneFauxhemianRhapshody
      2/18/16 2:01pm

      It does if your number one priority is the wealthy paying as little in taxes as possible.

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      XrdsAlumFauxhemianRhapshody
      2/18/16 2:09pm

      Many of those infrastructure projects are even older, from the New Deal era (before then the U.S.’s public infrastructure, like its economy, was a very different beast that would be unrecognizable to most modern Americans). It’s a testament to the quality and investment in FDR’s programs and to generations of public sector civil engineers that they’re still standing and operational. But that can’t go on forever, especially with the GOP trying to cut public spending on absolutely everything.

      In many other Western countries you’ll see construction completion dates posted near the walkways on even small overpasses. It serves as a marker of civic pride but also a reminder that even something seemingly permanent has a limited service life. If we can’t have a new WPA we could at least institute this practice on the Federal level as a standard.


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    endusoneHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 1:53pm

    Despite my disdain for increasing the power and scope of government, I definitely agree that maintenance of road infrastructure is within the legitimate role of government.

    Where I disagree, though, is that the government needs to borrow a trillion dollars (you can’t be serious) or raise taxes to do this. Our government spends colossal sums of money on defense, industry subsidies, etc. There should be absolutely no issue whatsoever reallocating money to fund this program.

    You understand that something like a gas tax, which we already pay at the state level, impacts the poor as much or more than the wealthy, right? It’s like the left thinks that tax money just appears out of nowhere. There is a material impact to people from collecting it and we need to stop wasting it subsidizing things like the NFL.

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      ReverandRichardWayneGaryWayneendusone
      2/18/16 2:04pm

      Federal road improvements are paid for with the gas tax. As cars have become more fuel efficient, that revenue has declined compared to the cost of maintaining our highway system. It has not been raised since 1993 and is not indexed to the cost of inflation.

      This is a math problem, and a simple one. If you want first world roads, raise the gas tax.

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      Mr. S MuffinReverandRichardWayneGaryWayne
      2/18/16 2:20pm

      That’s odd, according to actual data gas consumption by US consumers is up about 35% since 1984.

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    jezbannedHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 1:54pm

    Goddamnit. If my taxes go up $200 per year, or if I have to pay $0.50 more per gallon of gasoline because some politician reads this and thinks “Yeah, having functioning infrastructure is an important public good” I am going to be fucking PISSED! That is not what government is about, fascist

    There are gays out there getting fucking married. And stopping THAT won’t cost me a goddamn thing.

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      kwikkyjezbanned
      2/18/16 8:08pm

      yeah! That FDR was a real facist with all his facism and everything. Good call!.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal-A…

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      jezbannedkwikky
      2/18/16 8:48pm

      True!

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    bourgeoismiddlemanHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 1:53pm

    I love the idea, but we literally do not have enough engineers to fix every bridge at once. Nowhere near. Sure that’s another part of the jobs program, but I don’t want a kid with a bachelor’s and no experience designing my bridge four years from now any more than I like a bridge that’s 25 years late for a remodel.

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      Elumererebourgeoismiddleman
      2/18/16 2:49pm

      So, let’s do nothing then.

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      bourgeoismiddlemanElumerere
      2/18/16 3:01pm

      Quitter. I’m just saying that the 21-year rate of improvement that is currently in motion can be sped up, but not eliminated immediately. Big problems should be fixed, but throwing money at the problem in order to hand out shovels is not the entire issue.

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    ShaunyPHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 3:47pm

    Why do we have to pay for it? Obviously people are happy as shit to hold our debt, judging from the price of it, so who says it has to be fully funded? There’s a shortage of safe assets. Issuing more treasuries plugs that hole and create private sector wealth. Less money from people’s paychecks and more A/D. Voila. Sometimes there can be free lunches in life.

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      Robb NunyaShaunyP
      2/19/16 10:55am

      TANSTAAFL. Your “idea” is a house of cards, and the thing bubbles are made of. We all know what happens when those bubbles pop.

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      ShaunyPRobb Nunya
      2/19/16 3:09pm

      What? How is that? People throw the “bubble” word around way too much. Even then, bubbles aren’t always bad. They gave us cheap technology, railroads, and loads of other things. A bubble doesn’t always mean ruin. When a government issues a bond it also creates an asset for the private sector, so it also creates wealth. Government bonds, when issued by a sovereign creditor that also controls the currency that bond is issued in, can never go bankrupt. It can cause inflation sure, but the only way it goes bankrupt is because it chooses to do so. Treasury bonds are uniquely special in the world of finance. There’s a reason people choose to hold more of them in times of financial turmoil.


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    PithyTheElderHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 2:00pm

    I live in Chicago. Most of the time I take the train, but on the days when I drive I go under a Metra commuter train bridge to get on the highway. The support columns for this bridge are crumbling to the point where, at least on one of them, it’s just a skeletal frame of rebar that I can see through to the other side. I am waiting for the day that this bridge collapses on me while I wait for the highway ramp to free up, but that day - and the prospect of sweet release - never seems to come.

    Counterpoint: don’t fix the bridges, we're all doomed anyway. Embrace the void.

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      Gunboy1096PithyTheElder
      2/18/16 2:12pm

      What are two seasons in Chicago?

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      PithyTheElderGunboy1096
      2/18/16 2:29pm

      “High Murder" and "(Comparably) Low Murder"

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    ╰(　´◔　ω　◔ `)╯< Woke and BokeHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 1:50pm

    If you really want this, there’s only candidate promising a massive Federal infrastructure program: Trump. His Huge Classy Wall could double as a road and/or bridge all the way around the perimeter of these United States (Alaska & Hawaii: get fucked). So there you have it, if you want to employ millions of Americans, NOT borrow trillions of dollars and NOT tax Americans (Mexico and Canada are paying for this) you should vote Trump.

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      Zoom╰(　´◔　ω　◔ `)╯< Woke and Boke
      2/18/16 1:57pm

      Not to be this guy, but Bernie has touted spending money on infrastructure as well.

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      ╰(　´◔　ω　◔ `)╯< Woke and BokeZoom
      2/18/16 2:05pm

      Unlike Bernie, Trump has a plan to fund it: make Mexico and Canada pay for it. Before anyone asks for specifics. Here they are:

      Blockade oil, drugs, maple syrup, corn syrup, and comedian shipments from Canada/Mexico and levy a 150% tax on them.

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    benjaminalloverHamilton Nolan
    2/18/16 1:51pm

    Our government in Canada is “speeding up and doubling down” on infrastructure spending in spite of the fact that our deficit is waaaaay bigger than the previous government had said (liars). The reason is threefold; it’s a jobs program, the infrastructure needs fixing, and the value to cost ratio will never be higher. I feel like the same math applies in the U.S., just a different political environment where government spending is concerned.

    ETA: I can’t reply to anyone who replies to me, so please blame kinja

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      Listener42benjaminallover
      2/18/16 3:28pm

      That bug happened to me on another Kinja site. Try now.

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      benjaminalloverListener42
      2/18/16 3:30pm

      Ya I e-mailed the help desk and it’s stopped.

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