Kinja reply list

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Misteaks were madeMax Read
7/06/15 3:05pm
It has no standing to lecture other nations.

Being the EU’s most successful modern economy says otherwise. We’re not talking about paying back war reparations from the 1940’s. You only have to look at the success of VW (thanks at first to the US and UK), Bayer AG, Siemans AG and ThyssenKrupp to see that Germany can make up much more value that any 70 year old debt. Does Greece have that large of a tourist economy or olive oil industry to equal even those 4? No.

When Greece is an industrious or a manufacturing giant as Germany, then we’ll talk. Until then, drachma your way down the lane Greece.
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  EasttoMidwestMisteaks were made
  7/06/15 3:17pm
  I don’t understand your argument. You’re saying that Greece shouldn’t be forgiven (part of) its debts because they don’t have the infrastructure to pay them, whereas it was right to forgive Germany’s because they had the potential to rebuild the very industry that could have allowed them to pay it back?
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  Medieval KnievelMisteaks were made
  7/06/15 3:18pm
  Are you saying that because they discharged their debt and grew into a dominant world economy, they are in a position to scold other nations against addressing their debt in a similar manner?
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AJ Archer-KaneMax Read
7/06/15 3:01pm
War debt is not the same thing as what Greece has done. Greek debt wasn't due to violent conflict, it was due to not collecting taxes and paying out generous benefits. One of those two cannot be true in order for the system to work. Either you collect taxes and then you can pay out generous benefits or you have low taxes and you don't pay generous benefits.
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  Hugh Mann BeanAJ Archer-Kane
  7/06/15 3:11pm
  You should be fired from your job as an Economist.
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  poshbygoshAJ Archer-Kane
  7/06/15 3:11pm
  So, you put a moral value on the kind of debt incurred to determine whether it should be repaid? I understand why, but that doesn’t change the fact that Greece will not be able to pay back the debt they have under the current terms, regardless of morality.
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IkerCatsillasMax Read
7/06/15 3:00pm
Piketty is a fucking champ.

For those of you who don’t know the history, here’s the solution he’s referring to when he talks about German debt after WWII, which was treated very differently — and with far better results — than German debts after WWI.
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  gottaletitburnIkerCatsillas
  7/06/15 3:14pm
  “An important term of the agreement was that repayments were only due while West Germany ran a trade surplus, and that repayments were limited to 3% of export earnings. This gave Germany’s creditors a powerful incentive to import German goods, assisting reconstruction.”
  
  Quick, what can we import from Greece? More olives and ouzo for everyone!
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  Paddle PawsIkerCatsillas
  7/06/15 3:14pm
  And the handling of WWII debt was essentially a kindness to Germany, even after it decided it just didn’t wanna pay after WWI and figured starting another world war would be more fun.
  
  I feel for the poor German peasants who were just trying to scrape by. I do. But how many mulligans does Germany get before Europe realizes how dumb it is to keep granting them anything resembling power over other nations?
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KinjaJustFeeldaTensionMax Read
7/06/15 2:57pm
It’s been a while since I studied this stuff, but post-war German debt was largely reparations, not borrowing. Said differently, it was imposed by others, not voluntarily undertaken by Germans or German leadership.
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  planiganKinjaJustFeeldaTension
  7/06/15 3:03pm
  Does that matter in practical terms? Or is it more a matter of principle?
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  KinjaJustFeeldaTensionplanigan
  7/06/15 3:07pm
  To me, it speaks (in a small way) to the question of the “moral stance regarding repayment of debt.” The party who decides to take on excessive debt voluntarily is more serving of ostracism, in my view, than one who is saddled with excessive debt by the judgment of others.
  
  Of course, the whole morality behind war is another layer of the onion.
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EasttoMidwestMax Read
7/06/15 3:23pm
I just got back from Greece last month, and one thing no one is talking about is something that people, in Crete at least, talked about a lot. They were brutally occupied by the German’s during living memory and kept up a remarkable resistance that we tend to forget about, if we ever learned it in the first place. But it’s very real, living history there, with monuments and sites where the Greeks resisted the Germans.

The idea that it’s Germany in particular who’s trying to demand austerity is very psychologically and historically significant to Greeks.
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hardcöre umlautMax Read
7/06/15 2:56pm
I would be happy to put my German degree to work and translate this for you if you want the most literal, awkward sounding translation in the history 0f the world.

Also you have to update the sausage.gawker.com logo according to my demands.
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  Joanbeamhardcöre umlaut
  7/06/15 4:25pm
  Is it okay to be relieved that you did not go on a hunger strike with respect to your ongoing attempts to “negotiate” with sausage.gawker.com?
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  ihatepickingnamesJoanbeam
  7/06/15 4:34pm
  omg don’t give her any ideas.
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gramercypoliceMax Read
7/06/15 3:13pm
Funny story for the know-nothing’s who think Greece should be punished for being Greece. Germany never repaid loans made by Greece under duress due to the occupying Nazi government forcing them to loan money to Germany. Via Wikipedia:

In 1942, the Greek Central Bank was forced by the occupying Nazi regime to loan 476 million Reichsmarks at 0% interest to Nazi Germany. In 1960, Greece accepted 115 million Marks as compensation for Nazi crimes. Nevertheless, past Greek governments have insisted that this was only a down-payment, not complete reparations.^[1] In 1990, immediately prior to German reunification, West Germany and East Germany signed the Two Plus Four Agreement with the former Allied countries of the United States, Great Britain, France, and the Soviet Union. Since that time, Germany has insisted that all matters concerning World War II, including further reparations to Greece, are closed because Germany officially surrendered to the Allies and to no other parties, including Greece. On Sunday, February 8, 2015, the Greek Prime Minister, Alexis Tsipras appeared in front of the Greek parliament and officially demanded that Germany pay further reparations to Greece.^[2] On April 6, 2015, Greece demanded Germany pay it the equivalent of $303 billion in reparations for the war. Germany replied that the reparations issue was resolved in 1990.^[3]
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  Audubonergramercypolice
  7/06/15 3:25pm
  This ^^
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ManchuCandidateMax Read
7/06/15 3:00pm
Germany, the national ~~payday loan~~ loan shark lender of Europe.

Also, pretty bad burn of Germany by a Frenchman.
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GMOCMax Read
7/06/15 3:29pm
Inflation is really a way to default and also how country’s like Argentina typically erase their debts...unless that debt is dollar denominated. In that case they can’t inflate away the debt. Country’s almost never actually default in their own currency (although Russia did and left everyone scratching their heads). This is the problem Greece currently face in using the Euro, they can’t inflate away because they don’t use the Drachma anymore.
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blameitonthecroutons goodbye tourMax Read
7/06/15 2:58pm
Essentially, it consists of three components: inflation, a special tax on private wealth, and debt relief.

Every banker just shit their pants.
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