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    he7788Hamilton Nolan
    5/14/14 10:22am

    Think of how much cheaper things could be for customers if they weren't constantly training new employees because the old ones hated it so much.

    This is the real stupidity of Amazon. Many of the costs associated with turnover do not show up on financial reports. 90% of errors that a company makes are made by people in their first 90 days of employment. Then you have the time drain on the people who have to train these new hires, the managers who have to stop what they are doing to give extra assistance to someone new, or has to address and fix an error. People are less productive in their first year because they are still learning.

    High turnover has massive costs to an organization, far higher than hiring additional staff or investing more in retaining staff. Good companies set goals for turnover to make sure it does not get out of control.

    Amazon is probably only looking at the salaries of their recruiting staff and the cost to place ads.

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      PardonMyFlemish16he7788
      5/14/14 10:30am

      Wow, never knew one could become such an expert on a company based on letters written by a handful of disgruntled employees as part of an obvious smear campaign.

      Based on this contract worker's letter what do you think is the dollar amount Amazon is losing off of turnover? Where'd you get that 90% figure from? Where's your data showing this 90% figure holds true to Amazon?

      If this is what labor activism in America has been whittled down to the American worker is doomed. This is disgraceful

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      Lobstertailhe7788
      5/14/14 10:43am

      that's one way of looking at it. The other way is that high turnover makes people work harder and perform better out of fear that they could be let go or reassigned to shit duty at any moment.

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    StenchofaburnerHamilton Nolan
    5/14/14 10:18am

    Man, I wish some of the former Euro Amazon employees would write to you. Specifically, the ones that used to work at the European headquarters back when they were in The Netherlands (this was before 2001 or so? my memory might be failing me, but I do know they left before 2002). Amazon was known as the workplace where people went in the morning and started smoking weed and kept doing it until it was time to check out. It was the most fun workplace for every Euro reject that had a modicum of technical and/ or customer service skills. Since they served all of Europe, they employed native speakers of all European languages (French, British, Spanish, German, etc etc) and their workforce was a carnival like collection of backpacker types that were just passing by The Netherlands and got a job for a few months. From the perspective of corporate performance, it was an utter disaster. But everyone I met who worked there (easily a dozen people, since we used to overlap in tech company employment circles) claimed it was the most fun they had ever had. No shit the company ended up closing those offices, though.

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      toothpetardStenchofaburner
      5/14/14 10:21am

      I wonder if the conditions were different for people who actually worked, like putting stuff in boxes, etc.

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      Stenchofaburnertoothpetard
      5/14/14 10:26am

      European countries (specifically, Northern Europe - The Netherlands, Germany, Scandinavia) have a very strong union negotiated legal framework for warehouse employees (and for all blue collar professions, to be fair). Mandatory minimum salaries, paid vacation, health and safety norms -including sick days, visits to doctors, etc. So, even if Amazon was shit, they would have been obliged to comply with those laws. I did read recently that the German Amazon workers (Amazon is quite big in Germany) were not very happy with their conditions, however, things have changed in the past ten years or so with the raise of more neoliberal "flexible" working conditions so that might be different from the time I used to know details of the Euro tech industry.

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    Angelo GalloHamilton Nolan
    5/14/14 10:19am

    Sounds like Amazon needs to unionize. Enough of this crap in the workforce. In what world is it okay to force someone to work (essentially) two weeks in one and not pay them for all the hours? It is not okay. In fact it might even be illegal. This is one among many problems with today's corporations. Enough is enough. FYI, in general, I am not pro-union but when I am it is for reasons as those outlined in this article. Unacceptable.

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      Hamilton NolanAngelo Gallo
      5/14/14 10:25am

      Amazon has beaten back unions thus far but I have to believe that at least one of the big international unions will set their sights on them soon. Although the weird composition of their work force won't make unionization easy.

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      duhasstmichAngelo Gallo
      5/14/14 10:37am

      I work as a contractor. When you have a cap on your hours, you tell your supervisor and stop working, you don't sack up and screw yourself out of money. Unless it was a firm fixed price contract (you have to complete all agreed work regardless of how much time), this guy just isn't smart about being a contractor.

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    The Ghost of ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ AKA BabyStepsHamilton Nolan
    5/14/14 10:26am

    After reading these stories I know I have to "untrain" myself to use Amazon less. That said, it will be difficult for a number of reason not least of which is just simple habit. My very first impulse when I want something is to go to Amazon. And it's not like I didn't have an inkling of how little they care about anything else besides squeezing profit out of each and every point in the sale. I have gone through a couple of rounds of selling things through their website (several years ago it was my DVD collection and right now my CD collection) and you can absolutely feel how little they care about the people who generate money for them.

    In any event, I really have to train myself to look elsewhere for my purchases.

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      VanillaLipsThe Ghost of ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ AKA BabySteps
      5/14/14 10:54am

      TFOG —

      (net snark off)

      Can you elaborate (for this dumbass semi-oldster) on the need for such an "untraining" and the allure of Amazon? Is it simply that you can buy shit somewhat cheaply on the computer and have it at your house the next day? Do you live in some far-flung locale where you can't go to "the store," "the mall," or any place at all?

      Just curious. I've never really understood why peeps are into Amazon...other than "cheap" and "easy" and "quick." The reviews can be funny, I guess? (Disclosure: I used to work at Barnes and Noble, so there's that.) Due to the labor issues (which have been public knowledge for years) I've refused to buy any damn thing from them, with "any damn thing" usually meaning music imports/remasters. LOL

      VL

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      samarkandThe Ghost of ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ AKA BabySteps
      5/14/14 11:19am

      For me, it's not buying shit cheaply (it's got to be a pretty significant purchase/difference for me to care), it's buying any shit I want, at any time I need it.

      Anecdote: It's spring and it's rainy where I live. I have a 2-year-old who loves to play outside, and who doesn't love a toddler in a little yellow raincoat and hat? So, off I go to Target (which, I know, is another malign retail influence) and... according to the merchandise at Target it is currently August and 90 degrees and we're all at the beach. No rain gear. No galoshes. Same at Babies R US, same everywhere I go (even the crazy expensive little local boutiques). Every time I ask employees where the rain gear is (as it is bucketing down rain outside at that very moment) they look at me like I have 3 heads.

      The same exact situation happened with sunscreen several weeks ago when we had an early spring sunny/heat wave and I have a blindingly white family to protect from the sun. But no sunscreen at the drug store because it's not the approved we-sell-sunscreen-now season.

      That's when I am tempted to run to Amazon. When I am desperately TRYING to buy something locally and failing utterly.

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    phunkshunHamilton Nolan
    5/14/14 11:40am

    It's still astounding to me that employee actually called me out when I mentioned that this wasn't a healthy work environment for...anyone...ever. I was even more surprised that there's seemingly an entire group of people out there that considers that shit acceptable.

    No permanence. 3 year turnovers. No feedback from higher ups. Onerous work hours.

    This is not how human beings should exist.

    Also, that intern work on the bosses bonus? That is straight illegal under labor law unless he's being paid.

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      The Ghost of ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ AKA BabyStepsphunkshun
      5/14/14 7:06pm

      evidence of why we can't have nice things. There is always someone who thinks that the unlubed dildo should be shoved in further, harder and faster!

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    thedogsbollocksHamilton Nolan
    5/14/14 10:12am

    Hamilton's personal war on big retail continues...

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      toothpetardthedogsbollocks
      5/14/14 10:16am

      I too am butthurt by having to read of how awesome it is to work at amazon.

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      kinjaninjafinjathedogsbollocks
      5/14/14 10:23am

      you say that like it's a bad thing...?

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    not-youHamilton Nolan
    5/14/14 10:14am

    My immediate response to this is to say "No more shopping at Amazon! Only buy at local book stores!!" But then I remember I'm broke and have no consumer influence anyway.

    Capitalism? More like Crapitalism...amiright??

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      beensoburnedHamilton Nolan
      5/14/14 10:35am

      I use them for digital goods, but the Hatchette brow beating was the last straw. Moving back to iTunes or Google Play ...or, gasp, buy a real book at a local bookstore.

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        Lorie Franklynbeensoburned
        5/14/14 5:15pm

        Good luck finding a brick and mortar bookstore. We were all so busy shopping online that most of the book stores have closed.

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        Toddbeensoburned
        6/14/14 1:38pm

        you do realize that the Hatchette issue does go both ways? Last I checked in negotiations neither side are the good or the bad thus your logic makes no sense since Apple and Google do the same on the regular. They just don't make it as transparent. May wanna think out your plan first there before spouting nonsense. Also yes a Real Book is always good to have so I agree w/ that logic 110%.

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      Arctic16Hamilton Nolan
      5/14/14 10:44am

      Holy shit! Sending emails at 1 AM? Fuuuuuuuuuuuck that. You won't ever catch me doing that shit. As I've said before: yeah, I'll die poor and these people won't, but hopefully I won't need to write a blog to vent my frustrations about my position in white-collar feudalism because I'm sending work emails in the middle of the night.

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        GregorMendelHamilton Nolan
        5/14/14 11:50am

        The husband in the NYT Magazine article, "Addict. Informant. Mother." worked at an Amazon warehouse. I couldn't help but notice that he was promoted twice while addicted to heroin. Guess that's what it takes to get by and ahead.

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